#03 Nappy Leaks Podcast: Q&A Sep 2017

This week Vashti and Vicki answer some questions put forward by long term cloth nappy users. The questions they ask are things they were concerned about before they became full time cloth nappy users.

Some of the questions included are.

  • How many nappies do you recommend for part-time, full-time per child?
  • What's the difference between side-snapping and rise-snapping?
  • How tight should it be snapped up?
  • Are reusable nappies really better for the environment when you factor in power used for washing and detergents.
  • Do you sell newborn nappies? I want to buy some as a gift?
  • Will cloth nappies affect sleep?
  • Will I get poo in my washing machine?
  • How should I store my dirty nappies?
  • How often should I change my bub in cloth nappies?
  • What about babies' hips?
  • But she wants to know if it will affect walking or crawling.
  • Are there any tricks putting on a side snapping nappy, folding the inserts so there are no leaks?
  • What are the best strategies to inform your loved ones of your new vice?
  • How long does it generally take for addiction to occur?
  • I know you launched the friends of ANA a few weeks ago. Do you guys want to tell people what the friends of ANA is?


Transcription: Q&A Sep 2017

Andrew: So how are you Vicki?

Vicki: I'm good Andrew.

Andrew: Excellent, good to see you're awake.

And how are you doing Vashti?

Vashti: Great thanks Andrew.

Andrew: Excellent.

Vashti: How are you today?

Andrew: This is one of those podcasts where we wish you'd heard what happened before the podcast.

So, today I wanted to just field [00:00:30] some questions from some longtime cloth nappy users. These are the things that they had problems with before they started using cloth.

So the first one I've got is from Haley, and she asks, "How many nappies do you recommend for part-time, full-time per child?"

Vashti: Comes down very much to how old your baby is. In the early days, in those first three to four months you're changing around 10 to 12 times a day. But by the time they hit around six months, you're down to around about six to eight.

Vicki: So for a toddler to do part-time [00:01:00] cloth nappies you could get away with about 10 to 12. And full-time about 18 to 20. But for a newborn you're looking at around 10 to 15 for a part-time use. And about 30 to 36 for full-time use. And that's washing every second day.

Andrew: Washing every second day? Okay.

She's got a follow up question. What are the differences between flushable bamboo liners and micro fleece liners?

Vicki: One's reusable and one's ...

Vashti: One use.

Vicki: Single use. So your [00:01:30] flush-able liners are, well, technically anything that goes down the toilet is flush-able.

Vashti: Matchbox cars included.

Vicki: Yes, and mice. But, we won't go there. So what I personally recommend is with flush able liners is if it's dirty and has poo on it dispose of it in the toilet. So that the poo is dealt with in the sewage system, and if it's wet just pop it in the bin. With a micro fleece [00:02:00] liner, same concept, you put the poo in the toilet, but, you have to ... Sometimes it rolls off, sometimes you have to scrape it off. But, it's just a way of protecting your nappies from having poo.

Andrew: That reminds me of something I saw on the website on Facebook a little while ago. People are posting pictures of their poo-scoopers. Have you noticed that?

Vicki: No.

Vashti: No.

Andrew: Yeah. Somebody posted the picture of their pooper-scooper the other day.

Vashti: What sort of groups are you in? Where on earth on Facebook are you looking to find [00:02:30] pictures?

Andrew: This was in the Bubblebubs VIP group.

Vashti: Okay. I did see that actually. It was named.

Andrew: You've seen. That's right, she even stuck a name on it.

Vashti: Poo scooper wasn't it? Or poo paddle? Or ...

Andrew: That's cos you don't want to mix those up.

Vashti: No.

Vicki: See, I'm not special enough to be in the Bubblebubs VIP group, obviously.

Vashti: No, you're in the Bubblebubs retailers group.

Andrew: So, Jenna wants to know, what's the difference between side-snapping and rise-snapping?

Vashti: So a side-snap nappy is [00:03:00] how the nappy closes. And it will do up around on the hips. And that's how you bring the front and the back of the nappy together.

Andrew: And I've seen some of them have got two rows, and some of them have got one row.

Vashti: Yeah, so normally with a side-snap nappy you'll get two rows. It's very uncommon to get only one row on a side-snap. On a front-snap, so where the nappy does up traditionally at the front of the baby, you can quite regularly get a one row of snaps [00:03:30] there. The rise-snaps are the snaps that go down the front of the nappy, and they will actually adjust how high up the nappy sits on the baby's waist.

Vicki: Yeah, and I think what Jenner was getting to was, well in particular the Candies don't have rise-snaps, so how that works is it naturally folds with the baby as you pull it around to the sides. It's a bit hard to explain on a podcast. It's certainly easier to see in a video how the rise [00:04:00] comes up naturally. Whereas with rise-snaps you have to fold it down, and then put your clasp in.

Vashti: Your closures. Yeah. The other beautiful thing about side-snap nappies is especially with the double row of snaps for a side-snap is that you can offset those snaps so you can ... The bottom row will adjust how tight it is around your baby's legs. Whereas the top row will adjust the tightness around the waist. So, if you've got a bubby with chunky thighs, but a skinny waist, you can snap [00:04:30] out the bottom row of snaps around the thighs. And that will open up the leg hole, whereas the top row you can do a little bit tighter and keep it nice and snug around the waist. Or alternatively, the other way round, skinny thighs and a chunky waist. Snap it in around the thighs and out around the waist. And it gives you a lot of flexibility with your nappy, and getting it perfect for your baby.

Andrew: So, a followup question would be, how tight should it be snapped up?

Vicki: Well, tight enough that you don't get leaks, but not [00:05:00] so tight that you're cutting off circulation and things like that. It is common that you would get some form of a mark if you like, from any nappy. Similar to when you've got underwear on, it only becomes a problem if it's quite indented, and it doesn't go away. Or it gets red and irritated. But normal underwear type indents are perfectly normal.

Vashti: If their toes are blue, it's too tight.

Vicki: [00:05:30] Yeah.

Andrew: So the answer to that question would be, watertight.

Vicki: Yeah.

Vashti: Yeah. I always like to say you want to be able to slide your finger in and feel the nappy pulling against your finger, but you don't want to see any gapes around the legs or the waist.

Andrew: So Louisa's question is, "Are reusable nappies really better for the environment when you factor in power used for washing and detergents.

Vicki: Yes, I think the big difference between single use and reusable nappies is [00:06:00] the fact that you can decide what your footprint is. With the disposable you have no choice. All of the studies pretty much just the lifecycle of the nappy from beginning to end. But with reusables in particular, it's not the actual end, it only takes into consideration the use on one child. Also with disposable nappies, when they're talking about [00:06:30] the impact on the environment, the fact that they're in landfill for 800 years also is factored in to the studies. So, yes, at the end of the day, yes they are better for the environment. And you can reduce your impact even further by line drying, washing in lower temperatures, using eco friendly detergents. Or there of course you can use your dryer, you can use an iron [00:07:00] to iron your Terry flats like they did in one study. Because who doesn't iron their nappies?

Andrew: That sounds like one of those things that they're just trying to find ways to screw it up, aren't they?

Vicki: Yeah, yeah. Pretty much, pretty much. So, yeah.

Andrew: Okay. So this is Theresa's question, but this is obviously a question obviously designed to bate you both. Do you sell newborn nappies? I want to buy some as a gift?

Vicki: [00:07:30] You planted this didn't you?

Andrew: She really asked that question. She really asked that question. Do you sell newborns, I want to buy some as a gift?

Vashti: Yes.

Andrew: And give as a gift.

Vashti: Yes. Today in the shop I had a lovely woman coming in, and her niece is pregnant with her first child and this particular lady didn't know whether or not her niece would use close nappies, but she bought a beautiful little newborn all-in-one with a whole heap of accessories and she decided one nappy was enough to see whether or not her niece would like [00:08:00] the idea of it and be interested in using them.

So definitely I sell a range of newborn nappies. I know Vicki has got her gorgeous Pebbles and her Bambams that are in stock.

Vicki: Yeah they tend to sell really quite well as a gift. And the trial packs and stuff like that. They're at a nice price point of $50, it's a good gift for baby showers.

Andrew: In other words, the answer is yes.

Vashti: Yes, yes, and more yes!

Vicki: We do. Do you know this whole podcast [00:08:30] is actually, we try to keep it really non-specific. It's not a salesy thing. If you'd like me to pimp out, you know, I can.

Andrew: So the next question's from Felicity, and she wants to know, will cloth nappies affect sleep?

Vicki: I think it's a very individual thing. All three of my children were cloth nappied overnight. My youngest is still in cloth nappies overnight and he sleeps beautifully. [00:09:00] He's slept really well from quite an early age, and he was in cloth at the hospital, and we stopped changing his nappy overnight within the first few weeks. And while he was still waking for feeds, he would go back to sleep very, very early, or very quickly after that and we don't have an issue. Through winter, I can quite regularly get him to sleep in until eight, eight thirty if it's a non-school day, and he's in the same cloth nappy that I put him in at seven, seven thirty the night [00:09:30] before.

Andrew: I love babies when sleeping.

Vicki: They're awesome, aren't they?

Andrew: Fantastic. They're my favourite babies.

Vicki: I'm a big fan though of using a dedicated night nappy. So, ensuring that you have more than enough absorbency to get you through a full 10 to 12 hours and having a great wool cover over the top of it, for lots of breathe-ability.

Andrew: So next question is from Morgan, and her question is, what are [00:10:00] the differences in style? We've kind of covered that in our first podcast, so I'm not gonna ask that question again. Her next question is, how can I clean off poo? We've kind of covered that, but do you guys want to field that one again? Besides the pooper scooper?

Vashti: Sure.

Vicki: Scrape it off!

Vashti: The pooper scooper. One of my friends had the poo spoon. She kept it in her bathroom and it was labelled, and she'd scrape. So there's lots of different ways that you can get rid of poo, I'm a big fan of-

Vicki: Husbands.

Vashti: Yeah.

Vicki: We've covered this before. Husbands and partners.

Vashti: Yeah. [00:10:30] I'm a big fan of, if you're 100% breastfeeding, keeping in mind that your breastfed baby poo is water soluble, you can let your washing machine take care of it if you want to, or rinse it out under the laundry sink. You can use liners, either one use or single use liners, or reusable liners, and they just make getting rid of poo really easy and simple.

Vicki: Which I wouldn't worry about for newborn.

Vashti: No, definitely not.

Vicki: That's kind of a bit of a waste.

Vashti: The Meconium?

Vicki: Oh yeah.

Vashti: Meconium, definitely. [00:11:00] I am a massive fan of a one use liner for Meconium. Nobody wants to deal with that tar-iness.

Andrew: Don't you want to just burn that?

Vashti: It's very tempting. So yeah, you've got the liners you can scrape. You've got things like the Little Squirt, which is the high pressure water hose. You hook it onto the water inlet valve of your toilet, and they just hose your nappy out. The biggest things that I always say though, it's really important to get the poo where it belongs and that's in the toilet, because our sewage treatment system is [00:11:30] the place to deal with sewage. So it shouldn't go in the bin under any circumstances. So if you are single use liners and you don't want to flush those, I always suggest giving them a dunk, swish and flush in the toilet, and then binning the liner. Get as much poo off as possible and bin it.

Andrew: So her next question is, will I get poo in my washing machine?

Vicki: Well that's where doing a short wash to start with, like a 30 minute wash or a prewash [00:12:00] or something like that, with a bit of detergent is going to rinse any kind of residual.

Vashti: Any floaties.

Vicki: Yeah, all that sort of stuff. And then when you go to do your main cycle, then you're washing in clean water. So will you get poo in your washing machine? Well of course, if you're gonna put poo in there, but that's what washing machines are for.

Vashti: It's the same as if you're toilet training. When you're toilet training a toddler poos in their pants, you're gonna give them a sort of-

Vicki: [00:12:30] You're not gonna throw them in the bin just because they pooed their pants. You'll get as much as you can off, and then you let the machine deal with the rest. A machine is there to wash dirty clothes. It washes grease, and in fact to be honest I think a husband's or a partner's greasy diesel mechanic type clothes are going to do more damage to your machine than poo ever would, because it's a protein that is easily-

Vashti: Degraded.

Vicki: Degraded by the [00:13:00] detergents that you're using, especially if you're using enzymes and stuff like that. They're designed to break down all of those molecules.

Andrew: Well my answer to that question would be, if you've still got poo on your nappies after you've washing them, you've got a very inefficient washing machine.

Vicki: And yeah, your routine needs to be looked at. Because no, you should not have residual poo. No.

Andrew: We had our son throw up the other day, and I just put everything in the washing machine.

Vicki: Oh yeah, there was no rinsing or anything.

Andrew: Yeah, nobody wanted to go near that because [00:13:30] it smelt worse than poo, and the washing machine handled it. I just put it on a prewash and it handled it. So yeah, if your washing machine's not handling it, it's time for a new washing machine.

Vicki: Having said that, it is important to also clean your washing machine from time to time. At least once a decade. Quite seriously though, you would wipe it out to make sure, especially front loaders, that they're not getting mouldy and stuff like that. Running a vinegar rinse through, a hot [00:14:00] wash with vinegar through your washing machine's certainly not gonna do any harm. Give all the little bits a clean.

Andrew: So Beck's question is, how should I store my dirty nappies?

Vicki: So I love storing my dirty nappies in large wet bags, or hanging pails, especially here in Southeast or anywhere north in the tropics, I'm not a fan of a bucket, because once you put the lid on the bucket to keep in any smells it becomes warm and moist and humid and mould goes absolutely berserk, because you've got some really great proteins [00:14:30] in the dirty nappies for mould to feed on.

Andrew: It's a perfect growing environment for mould.

Vicki: It is. So something with a bit of airflow is really important-

Vashti: Yeah.

Vicki: A basket.

Vashti: Why, a basket. Yeah. Even a cane basket, I'm seeing people use a cane basket with a mesh liner in it. The mesh liner makes it easier to pick up the dirty nappies and empty them into the machine.

Vicki: I completely forgot about how to get rid of poo! Because we had, let's just [00:15:00] say, an easily accessible nappy bucket at one stage. Dogs! Dogs are amazing for getting rid of poo. You don't have to worry about liners and anything like that. A dog will clean your nappies for you, that's what you wanted to hear, wasn't it?

Andrew: Okay. Sarah's question is, how often should I change my bub in cloth nappies? And that's how long is a piece of string really, isn't it?

Vicki: Yeah. Well ideally, as soon as they're wet. Especially the whole [00:15:30] infant to toddler stage, understand of course newborn babies wet multiple times within a feed, so you wouldn't want to be changing every time. But yeah, with toddlers and infants, pretty much as soon as they do it. So for an infant it could be every two hours, for a toddler it could be every four hours. How long is a piece of string.

Andrew: So Fiona's question is, what about babies' hips?

Vashti: So [00:16:00] there is some concern out there that cloth nappies push babies' hips into an unnatural position, which can lead to issues down the track with hip development and stuff like that. There is no research to suggest that cloth nappies will have an adverse effect on your baby's hip development. In fact, it's the opposite. The way that the nappy holds your baby's legs [00:16:30] and the that they splay them out almost into a-

Vicki: A frog.

Vashti: A frog or an M shaped position, is much better for your baby's hip development because it puts the ball and the hip socket into a beautiful position for development. If there was an issue with cloth nappies and hip development, every person walking around today would have major hip issues because in years gone by, all our parents used terry flats, and they double terry flatted. [00:17:00] In fact-

Vicki: They do that for hip dysplasia now.

Vashti: So it's one of the things that's recommended for children who do have hip dysplasia and hip issues when they go into the brace that holds their legs up into that position. And if it's only a mild case, they will recommend cloth nappies and double cloth nappies, so that it puts them out and that's the first step before a brace. So definitely no. There's absolutely [00:17:30] no link between cloth nappies and any sort of hip issues.

Vicki: It's definitely one of those big myths.

Andrew: I remember wondering that myself actually. I remember in the early days, with Arabella-

Vicki: Yeah, I remember you-

Andrew: I was always worried about it. And I actually mentioned to Vicki a few times, because we were in the prototype stage. And I mentioned to Vicki a couple of times, but Arabella can't walk anywhere now. She runs everywhere, so it's obviously never been a problem. Sally has a question that's pretty much along the same lines, but she wants to know if it will affect walking or crawling.

Vicki: No.

Vashti: No. My eldest [00:18:00] was walking assisted at six and a half months. All three of my children have walked unassisted before 12 months. Every baby-

Vicki: Is different.

Vashti: Develops differently. Every baby will roll over at a different age. Some children will roll over within the first three to four months, and be sitting unassisted and even walking assisted, like cruising furniture and stuff, by the time they're [00:18:30] six to eight months. Other children decide that they just can't be bothered and they want to sit there and be carried, and so they won't start walking until they're like 15 months. It comes down to your baby, and cloth nappies are not going to make any difference to that whatsoever.

Vicki: If anything they'll probably cushion the falls a bit more.

Vashti: Yes. They make an awesome padding when they're learning to walk.

Andrew: So Jessica's question is, are there any tricks putting on a side snapping nappy, folding the inserts so there are no [00:19:00] leaks?

Vicki: Well with any nappies it's important that the inserts are contained within the elastic. So that's kind of the key. Well, I suppose it's my VIP crew so I'm assuming they're referring to Candies. Just running your fingers along the elastic will make sure that you've got a really nice seal around the legs and if there's any insert protruding, which it shouldn't be, but if there is, you can just [00:19:30] push it back in.

Again, I hate mentioning our products as their, you know, trying to keep it non-specific but with our newborn nappy, the way it's actually designed is for the legs to roll in, so it's really important that you give it a good stretch before putting it in. Any nappy, if you hold it at the front, and then pull at the back, the way an insert will kind of, what's the action [00:20:00] that I'm doing here? It'll kind of go in.

Vashti: It'll mould into it.

Vicki: That's it. It'll mould into the nappy when you actually stretch it. So if you do that with all of your nappies before you pop them on, you're gonna get a much better seal and no chance of anything protruding.

Andrew: So Rebecca has a few questions, but the first one is, what are the best strategies to inform your loved ones of your new vice? But that kind of says to me that she's afraid that people she knows won't be happy with her [00:20:30] using cloth nappies, when it's-

Vashti: They're a lot of misconception out there as far as cloth goes. A lot of people still believe it's the old school terry flats, so when you're talking to your friends and your family about the fact that you want to use cloth, they've got this idea in their head that you've got to soak them and scrub them and use pins. They're the old terry flats that need to be folded.

Vicki: And look, people just won't get the whole Kevin obsession. They just won't understand it. I understand it. [00:21:00] I think that's the hard part is, people don't really understand that it's fashion. It's not just the practical side of it, it does become a bit, kind of trying to find the right nappy for the right outfit, you know.

Vashti: Well it becomes part of the outfit. Especially in the warmer weather, where you can team your nappy up with a cute little dress, or a t-shirt and singlet. You don't need to put pants on over the top. You can colour coordinate. You can get a really nice [00:21:30] bright pattern on your nappy, and team it up with a very plain t-shirt, and you've still got some really fashionable clothing for your kids.

Andrew: I saw something on Facebook today, because it's starting to get a bit warmer, and she's going "Hooray! I don't want to put pants on him anymore. It's just the nappy and I can show off all the beautiful nappies."

Vicki: And it's also, cloth nappies are honestly the ultimate lazy parent outfit. The amount of times that our kids ran around in a singlet, [00:22:00] it was quite honestly a singlet and not a t-shirt and a nappy and that was it.

Andrew: Sometimes a singlet.

Vicki: Sometimes if we could even get that far.

Andrew: So her follow up question is, how long does it generally take for addiction to occur? I usually find it happens straight away.

Vicki: Usually the first print release. After you've got your stash, you're like all excited and then you find "Ooh, I like that print".

Andrew: I think it kind of is the fault of the manufacturers though by changing prints and doing cute prints all [00:22:30] the time.

Vashti: But in saying that as well, not everyone becomes addicted, so-

Vicki: Do you sell a lot of packs with just white nappies?

Vashti: Yep.

Vicki: Because I do too. You know, just plain, because they're just for function. Different strokes for different folks.

Andrew: Well they're obviously the people that think that the t-shirt should be the focal point.

Vicki: Exactly.

Vashti: Yes, exactly.

Vicki: Yep.

Andrew: So her last little comment is, how does it affect my daily life? And are there facilities to aid in my recovery?

Vashti: [00:23:00] So your daily life's going to affected by your cloth nappy addiction, by the fact that you are going to have an absolutely amazing time choosing prints and matching them up with your clothing and stuff like that.

Vicki: And you're going to have to instal an app similar to maybe Aftership. And you can type in your tracking number there and it will send you email updates for when your Fluffymail is going to arrive. As for rehab, I don't think there really is rehab however, [00:23:30] there is after children and that's called Adairs and linen. So the addiction just changes from nappies to linen. Well it did for me.

Vashti: Well see, I know when my big two were out of nappies, I turned my nappy addiction to a bit of a wet bag addiction. And we use wet bags for everything in our house. My big boy just went on school camp last week, and he had all his daily outfits packed into wet bags, so all he had to do was pull one out from the pouch.

Vicki: My god, how may wet bags do you use?

Vashti: I had a lot of wet bags.

Andrew: So you've got a wet bag addiction?

Vashti: I do have a wet bag addiction.

Andrew: How many [00:24:00] wet bags do you have?

Vashti: You don't want to know how many wet bags I have. I cannot count how many wet bags I have. But in saying that, we use wet bags for everything in our house. My partner has one that he takes to work for his gym clothes. When I was travelling, before I worked at Nest I was working for Itty Bitty, and we did the expos around [00:24:30] Australia, and I would actually pack my shoes into a wet bag, because I only had travel on luggage. And so my shoes would be in the wet bag so they didn't get on my clothes. I have wet bags for my Mama Cloth, I have wet bags for our nappies, I have wet bags for in the car, as a rubbish bag so that I can just throw little bits and pieces of rubbish in the wet bag and then empty it out.

Vashti: That's gold. Have you seen my cars. Three kids.

Andrew: I saw a blog [00:25:00] post "Things to do with your wet bag when you're not using them for nappies anymore".

Vashti: Look, I know someone who, this is years ago, they went to get a new goldfish and on the way home their kids had accidentally put a hole in the bag and the water was leaking out. So they put the goldfish in, in the plastic bag still, but put it in the wet bag and that actually contained enough of the moisture, so they were able to get home without it leaking completely everywhere.

Andrew: Wow. That's impressive.

Vashti: You can [00:25:30] put cut flowers in them, so when you're cutting your flowers, you wrap them in some wet newspaper, put it in a wet bag when you're taking it over someone's house. They make awesome wrapping paper as well. So if you're doing a baby shower gift, or a first birthday present, put whatever gifts that you're buying inside the wet bag, and then you don't need to worry about wrapping paper. So you're cutting down on your waste.

Vicki: It's really good for retail orders too. When they pick up their orders and they order wet bags, shove it all in there, don't need a box.

Vashti: [00:26:00] One of the things with the big kids, because we're at school now, and we get invited to birthday parties left right and centre, I now do little mini wet bags which are big enough to fit a chapter book or something like that, and we stack it full of little two dollar items and stuff, things that are usable like hair ties or little Matchbox cars or something like that. But the wet bag becomes the wrapping paper but it's also part of the gift. So [00:26:30] yeah, you can do so much with wet bags. I love them.

Andrew: Is there nothing wet bags can't do?

Vashti: Wet bags are amazing. So there you go Bec, when your nappy addiction's finished you can have a wet bag addiction.

Vicki: Or linen.

Vashti: Yeah.

Andrew: Actually I'm going through the linen addiction at the moment.

Vicki: He is! He's even liking these beautiful pink cushion pillow things that I got for the bed.

Andrew: Except it takes five minutes to get all the pillows off the bed when I've got to go to sleep.

Vashti: You can use [00:27:00] your wet bags as pillow slips as well. If you find a really nice print on your wet bag, shove a cushion in there and that becomes-

Vicki: Do you know I really like one of those new prints that we've just released. I could handle that on the bed.

Andrew: So guys, we've just got a couple more minutes left. And I just wanted you guys to talk about, I know you launched the friends of ANA a few weeks ago. Do you guys want to tell people what the friends of ANA is?

Vicki: The [00:27:30] friends of the ANA, we've kind of rejigged it a little bit, and what the friends of the ANA are now is, you guys. Pretty much anyone who would like to advocate cloth, needs a bit of support going to their daycare centre, that sort of things. The friends of the ANA was set up so you can, we've got a Facebook group so you can get that [00:28:00] support, but you can also tell us, the ANA, what you would like, like would you like to see a poster that you could give your childcare centre, which we already have, or your GP or something like that.

Yeah, it was kind of our way of reaching the grassroots consumers and finding out what you need from us, and also getting you guys on board to help us with some of our projects that, we just don't physically have the [00:28:30] manpower for. So things like, we tried to run a picnic in the park this year, and my vision for that was to just get mums out in the sunshine. So whilst yes, it was going to be cloth nappy focused, that wasn't going to be the main reason. We wanted to team up with PANDA, try [00:29:00] and get some gift bags, with some Ferrero Rochers and stuff like that, and the whole purpose was to get mums out of the house, into the sunshine and just meeting up with like minded mums. But that didn't happen, because we just didn't have enough hands on deck to organise it all around Australia. So we've kind of introduced the Friends of the ANA, which is the $20 lifetime membership fee, and for that, you actually get this really cool [00:29:30] bin sticker.

Vashti: And it's awesome!

Vicki: It is awesome. And the ANA's all about a positive message. What does it say, it say "we're making laundry not landfill" so that goes on your wheelie bin. And you also get a cloth nappy keyring and some posters and stuff like that. That's [inaudible 00:29:59].

Andrew: Excellent.

Vicki: Is there [00:30:00] anything that I've forgotten?

Vashti: No, I think that's it. It's really-

Vicki: It's us connecting. It's manufacturers and retailers and all the ANA members.

Vashti: Breaking down those barriers.

Vicki: Yeah.

Vashti: And making sure that you know that we are really approachable and that we're here to help. That's the big thing, we are here to help. We're here to-

Vicki: Get bums in cloth. That's ultimately what the ANA is all about.

Vashti: And we'd love your help with that too. So we can't do it on our own. We'd really [00:30:30] love for you guys to promote and advocate for cloth nappy usage. Your friends-

Vicki: And ultimately just grow cloth nappy use. And so some of these stigmatised questions and myths, you know and it would be great, the whole make cloth mainstream. That's the goal.

Andrew: So ANA stands for Australian Cloth Nappy Association.

Vicki: Australian Nappy Association.

Andrew: Australian Nappy Association. And the website is?

Vashti: Getintocloth.com.au.

Andrew: Wow, that's nice and simple [00:31:00] to remember.

Vashti: It's very easy.

Andrew: Thank for your time today Vashti.

Vashti: Thanks Andrew, thanks guys.

Andrew: Thank you Vicki.

Vicki: Thanks Andrew.

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